Glad you picked up on this one Stephen. It's so revealing.

Mr Mulroney is to testfy on behalf of the government and is risky nothing and will for sure gain.
Mr Colvin put it all on the line to testfy, he quite likley ended hid career.

On October 29, the AFGH sub-committee agreed on a witness list and five-panel schedule. http://www2.parl.gc.ca/HousePublications/Public...

Mr. Colvin was invited, Mr. Mulroney was not. Mr. Mulroney can be added to a proposed sixth panel, but there's no urgency for him to testify immediately. Otherwise, the Harper government should call an inquiry (not necessarily a FULL inquiry).

If it's true that David Mulroney flew back to Ottawa specifically to testify before AFGH, this is the most expensive tantrum in Canadian political history. In addition, Mr. Mulroney, along with any other Canadian, is free to submit documents and correspondence. If he wants to respond to Mr. Colvin's testimony, he can do so in writing.

Well then maybe the Opp parties should get their act together and bring down the government!

Yah, let's have an election over Afghans allegedly beating up Afghans in Afghan jails....
This would be a real winner!

If the Opps are going to accuse the Harper government of being complicite in war crimes,
an election should be demanded.

Yes wilson - if the opposition are unwilling to have an election over allegations our government turned a blind eye to torture and then lied to its citizens, the opposition should not question the government AT ALL.

Is that your new talking points? Because it is really weak.

take no prisoners.

Not to mention the fact it would be inappropriate for the opposition to do anything but try to get to the bottom of this before any election is called. But you do not want that because you are afraid of what they might find out.

PS - if the government really believes no one in Canada will care about torturing these prisoners, why are they going to such great lengths to hide the facts?

It's a non-issue for the majority of Canadians aside from Squeaky and her ilk who are deep into desperation mode. I agree Wilson, if they're going to do nothing more than make unsubstantiated, spurious accusations, the people should have a say in the matter.

A non issue? I take it you have not seen this:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ca...

The issue that's come out of this is the only issue and it's far more insidious, is the despicable behaviour of the opposition coalition obliquely branding the Harper government and our military forces in the field as war criminals. Another gotcha attempt gone mad. It's a national disgrace.

They should have the decency to apologize even though it wouldn't count for much but don't hold your breath. Some things are beyond forgiveness.

Mr Donolo and Mr Iggy should take a break in a Timmys, he'd get informed, the people are not amused, especially on a "Wear Red Friday".

That may be your issue Liz. The rest of the country is worried about Canada's reputation in the world.

Who is sullying Canada's and her Military reputation in the world?

This whole thing is all about the politics of the desperate.

The sullying of any reputation would be done by the people who decided it was OK to turn prisoners over to people who will torture them.

But don't let the facts get in your way. They never have before.

Gayle - you are the one who deplores personal attacks so you should retract your last sentence.

Actually, I deplore personal attacks in lieu of argument. I made my point, and feel no need to retract any part of the comment.

Gayle, may I remind you that you do not speak for all of Canada. You really cannot make statements like "the rest of the country". You speak for yourself and for yourself, alone.

I thought it was obvious that was just an expression.

In any event, the polls certainly show my position represents the majority of the country.

Wow, Gayle used a Poll to back up her logic. Best of luck getting your leftist propaganda handed to your via the "next poll" with

"In any event, the polls certainly show my position represents the majority of the country."

No, I used "polls".

Furthermore, I used said polls to demonstrate that the majority of Canadians think this issue is important.

Which is different than using a "Poll" to demonstrate that Harper is right, or the Liberals are wrong, or whatever else you attempt to use "Polls" for.

Polls are a reflection of popular sentiment. They do not prove one side is right and the other wrong, unless the disagreement is about which side represents the majority opinion.

I hope that helps.

Link on those Polls and dates. Could it be before the rebuttal testimony? hmmmmmm

The "Polls" I regularly refer to are called General Elections (Official) from 2000-2008 the LPOC were from 40.8% reduced to 26.3%. The FACTS speak for themselves. Best of luck.

Liz J

we have a small vocal community who believe the Taliban and their enablers they are right in their oppression of women and murder. If it means calling our sons and daughters war criminals so be it.

You give these people morals or principles. Clearly their only concern is power.

Chickens like to squawk but we both know the Liberals have been the best cheerleaders for the CPC since 2006.
Like most Canadians they believe Harper is the best PM and his party is the best in helping Canadians. (They just can't admit to for fundraising purposes)

Mr Mulroney isn't "any other Canadian" on this issue.

To say he is free to submit documents and correspondence or respond to Colvin's testimony in writing is about what we'd expect from any kangaroo court proceeding...don't allow for anyone who might question the testimony of the star witness or give an opposing view. Having written info sent to a committee for them to cherry pick is not a fit with our democratic process in a case such as this where our Forces and our Government are being obliquely accused of war crimes.

As for David Mulroney's flying back to Canada being the "most expensive tantrum in Canadian political history", that's just over-the-top rhetoric. Making that statement tells us you can't have been observing much political history in Canada over the past two decades.

The Opps may want to get some better help trolling Conservative blogs.

So you agree with the Liberals in muzzling anyone who has information that may break another hatchet job by the Liberals?

You probably wanted to muzzle Hillier too.

Harper is visiting China at the beginning of December and so I suspect that Mulroney will be a tad busy at the beginning of December. However, let him testify. The Committee can always call him back if they discover his evidence is incomplete, contrary to others etc. They did this with Schreiber and former PM Mulroney. Trouble is the opposition want to milk this thing for all it is worth before hearing from somebody who can tell the real story.

"Trouble is the opposition want to milk this thing for all it is worth before hearing from somebody who can tell the real story", absolutely right on hollinm, that's their game plan.

If Mulroney has to make several trips because of the games the opposition are playing they can hardly complain about the cost of his flights. China is not exactly right next door. I would assume Mulroney came at this time because, as Ambassador, he will be busy in China when the PM goes there in December.

If they refuse to hear the man when he's here, we know exactly what we're dealing with, a very irresponsible pack of desperate fools for whom partisan politics trumps all, the reputation of the Country, it's forces and the government the people elected to govern in this democracy. It may be closer to "Deranged Dominion" as" batb"calls it if these people continue to play their silly beggar games.

CBC CTV and opposition parties have plenty room where their taliban detainees will feel free to roam, naturally that leaves our troops at peace dealing with matters at hand.
And did Dion offer this country as a safe to the taliban detainees and not for the innocent souls.

No wonder the libs ndp and bloc who support terrorist groups just can't wait to add the taliban to their list. Wait a minute Liz, the taliban are added to their list. And very likely the national media will lay the red carpet for these taliban detainees.

The opposition are all about games. As long as the Polls show the CPC winnng the next election they will continue to prop up the government.
If they see an opportunity to gain seats again than they will try to muster the courage again. The Pollsters have shown MI a few windows he could have pulled the plug, he waited too long or is too afraid of a revolt after he posts a worse result than Dion.

This confirms for me, everything that I already suspected, it's not about THE TRUTH, it's about ANY version of the events that fits tightly into an agenda that can embrace another piece of the Liberal platform.

Their platform being, all things that their nasty little minds come up with that includes a hyphen and the word 'GATE'.

This double standard position by Dosanjh, clearly reveals that the truth has NOTHING to do with his agenda.
Creating and perpetrating the loudest and noisiest version of this weeks "hypen Gate" is the only game in town for the 1 policy platform, Liberal team and in this case, it's Dosanjh's baby.

Let's face it,the fix is in.

The Liberals and there friends in the PPG(The PPG really do love Donolo), are going to lie smear and do whatever it takes to try to take down the CPC.

The hypocrisy by the PPG and there Liberal friends re: Mr.Mulroney and Colvin just proves that there is a aganda.

I am so disgusted by the likes of Fife,Wells,Weston,Travers,Simpson,Kady,Wherry,Tommy Clark et al. These people have accused the government of War crimes on one mans word(This is very important, these people on one mans word have convicted the CPC and civil service of war crimes). They have smeared the CPC for defending themselves againts Colvin. Yet they do not want to here from Mulroney, and they insinuate that Mulroney is a CPC hack..

I am so sick of the PPG, they make me want to throw up, there is a agenda between the LPC and the PPG going on right now IMHO. This is worse then wafergate...

This will make for a great campaign video, the opposition and the MSM suggesting our sons and daughter are War Criminals.

We should not expect much from the opposition, they tried to steal power six weeks after a general election. It is only about power and money for these opposition parties.

Well, we are all going to have the pleasure of Rick Hilliers testimony tomorrow,
he is believable beyond doubt.

Hillarious how the opps are trying to muzzle 'select' diplomats.

Paul Wells (Macleans) has up the Dippers attack memo on Iffy and Torture.

Mulroney should just hold a press conference and say what he has to say. At least that way his message can get out and he won't have to answer questions from the opposition parties.

Co-Sign..

Then he would have to depend on an obviously bias and editorializing, MSM. If they would even show up......

After THIS WEEK, why would anyone trust the media to tell the truth? Their black eye is massive and their credibility, non existent.
A junior high school newspaper, does a better job than these overpaid pencil pushers.

Does Colvin think this will sink the govt and get the liberals back to the trough. What has he been promised, or what has the PPG been promised. When is his term up, and who appointed him. What a way to end a career. He has no evidence other that what someone told him. He has no interviews with the prisoners, no pics of torture. He has nothing, but what he says. If he had all those letters and emails, wouldn't he present them. Wouldn't he have saved copies. It is up to him to produce them.

Colvin has become persona non grata. Who would trust him at this point? He made "explosive" comments based on second and third hand information and suggested a cover up and torture was 100%.

The three generals and othe senior staff will protect our national interests and punch holes in his testimony.

With due respect, a Commons committee is probably one of the worst forums to deal with the matter of prisoner abuse and potential Canadian complicity. Names of highly respected individuals have been dragged through the mud with no chance to defend themselves. Statements made by witnesses, including Mr. Colvin, are accepted by some and rejected by others, and the opinions of committee members are entirely predictable, depending on their political affiliation.-Lewis MacKenzie
A public inquiry would be a colossal waste of taxpayers' money. The government should put the file back into the MPCC's lap and direct all players to co-operate. The commission has the highly qualified staff necessary to get to the truth of the matter in the most cost-effective manner

I suspect the past antics of this government have made it impossible to trust them.

You recall, I am sure, the little games they played when a committee was investigating the In and Out scandal.

Seems to me this whole thing could be settled very easily by the government producing the documents. Once they do so there is no reason for the opposition to block Mulroney from testifying.

In any event, the opposition have made it clear they want to hear from Mulroney, but only after they get the documents. How much do you want to bet that once Mulroney is not permitted to testify tomorrow, he will suddenly be unavailable when they do want him to testify.

All parties used the in and out, but only Conservatives were audited. Wonder why.

Because it is not true that all parties did what the CPC did.

It is not that hard.

Gayle, How do you feel about donating to the Liberals now?
I wonder what other rabid anti Harperites besides Gayle feel about donating their money to the Liberals so they can use it to prove Canada and it's troops are more effectively portrayed around the world as torture enablers.


http://www.cfra.com/?cat=3&nid=69580

Correct me if I am wrong, but did the American Ignatieff not come out in favour of torture if necessary? Has he publicly admitted the error of his ways? And...speaking of party antics, I seem to recall a certain Liberal former PM promising to scrap the GST.

The same reason Elections Canada won't collect the GST overpayments to the political parties.

Elections Canada is not doing their job and a recent court case found they are over stepping their jurisdictions.

Do you have a link to that court case?

Only one party is trying to return the taxpayers money.

The CTF has obtained a copy of a lawsuit filed Monday in Toronto Superior Court by the Conservative Party of Canada (CPC) against Elections Canada. The CPC argues they have been unjustly over-paid $591,117.40 in election reimbursements by Elections Canada for GST expenses for which the CPC was ultimately reimbursed by Revenue Canada for the 2004 and 2006 elections. Elections Canada reimburses political parties 50% for election expenses.

Gayle, have you re-filled your prescription for an anti-depressant?

If you are too lazy to google the terms court case Elections Canada.....too bad. I not interested in providing links dealing with the clown car brigade who add nothing to blogs but try to derail our democracy for more STATE control.

Gayle this is why you refuse to have a trail or blog for others to review your history,posts. You are ashamed.
----------------------------
Gayle
Ha!

"I think I have figured it out. CS is a joke. This has to be a comedy act. No one could be so deluded and blind to their own hypocrisy, coukd they? "
-------------------------------------
You and TG, RS, GR have your 'circus act' honed perfectly. Best of luck with your fascist views.

Poor CS.

You said a court case "found" EC are over stepping their boundaries. What you have now produced is a story that has absolutely nothing to do with that.

I do know about how the conservatives are arguing that EC over-stepped their bounds in the In and Out case, but there is a difference between what one party to litigation is arguing, and what the court "found". There has yet to be a ruling, (a "finding" if you will), and so no one knows as of yet whether what they are arguing will be accepted by the court.

To put it another way, I could initiate a law suit and argue the CPC are illegally stealing tax dollars in order to promote their own interests. Just because I argue it does not make it magically come true.

In other words, the person "over-stepping" here is you, by over-stating what has happened in the court.

I suggest you stop blaming me, or Ti, or anyone else for your shortcomings. Take some responsibility for yourself.

Gayle,

Your request to provide proof to you is not my Priority. If you are too lazy to look up recent headlines regarding Elections Canada, again sucks to be you. Just like the lazy clown car brigade it is NOT my responsibility to debunk your delusional rants.

Carry on....clown.

Ha Ha Ha

Having been shown to be wrong, CS goes on the attack.

There is no case where EC has been found to be a over stepping their bounds. You were wrong. Be an adult and admit it.

Gayle unlike you I can admit when I post the wrong word. (Verb tense is a serious matter for most liberals)
Next time feel feel free to provide links to make your point.
http://thegrammarexchange.infopop.cc/eve/forums...

There are two cases before the courts with Elections Canada.

1) Refusing to collect GST overpayments
2) Conservative Party probe by Elections Canada.

I was incorrect to have used "found" , I should have used "find". Neither case has been concluded and my incorrect word choice gives you intense "pleasure" because you have a gotcha moment.

Not much else left, LGR is gone...and you feel betrayed...

This reflects the pathetic state of affairs in the LPOC. Again kudos for your impressive feat in correcting my grammar.

Sadly it does not change the FACT the LPOC are on record for alleging our sons and daughters are guilty of War Crimes, our Generals are liars, our current ambassador to China is not honest.

They chose to believe the allegations of Colvin without any supporting documentation.

Continue with the witchunt, just like H1N1 facts are unimportant..just smears and allegations is the Liberal way.

Actually, neither "find" nor "found" is appropriate. All you have is the position taken by the CPC.

So while it is cute the way you try to make this about a grammatical error, it is pretty obvious that what you were really doing was referring to the arguments of the CPC without regard to the fact those arguments are simply a statement of their position. You thought those arguments represented the decision of the court. There is no other way to read your post.

This is made obvious by your frantic need to change the channel to something else. This, too, is par for the course for you.

An adult admits mistakes, they do not create more lies to cover them up. Though I totally understand why you did that - you seem to be following in the steps of your imperious leader. That Harper is a shining example!

The Canadian Taxpayers Federation are not taking the position of the CPC . Nice try. Every political party has millions of taxpayers monies and I want it returned.

Most Canadians will agree if Elections Canada is refusing to correct their accounting mistake in the overpayment of the GST, the Government must take them to court.

Gayle you are clearly taking the position of Elections Canada to to detriment of the law and tax fairness. Each political party must pay the taxpayer back if they were EC made a mistake.

Sadly Gayle this simple accounting mistake and refusal by EC to collect the over payment.

Every party is being held to the same standard and asked to return the GST overpayment.

Again Gayle the desperation is yours, I admitted to my grammar and my correction is noted. The Courts WILL FIND in favour of the Government regarding the GST overpayments. The CPC will also win their case. Nice try to avoid the subject and focus on the grammar and allege other motives.

Just like a Liberal to change the focus. The Post is about the Liberals being dishonest about cherrypicking testimony. Colvin and the Liberals have lost. Chantal agrees the stooges were reduced to props.
The "outcry" and rage has dies down when the three retired generals and our ambassador to China validated the position of the government.

Like a liberal with egg on your face, you have refused to apologize for your part in alleging wrongdoing by our sons and daughters. Shame Gayle.

I can see that you struggle with the English language, so I am going to try to make this simple.

At no point have I taken any "side". All I have done is demonstrate that you were wrong when you said a court found EC were acting outside their boundaries.

You have tried to come up with some excuse rather than simply acknowledge that which is painfully obvious to everyone else.

Gayle you have tried in your posts to change the focus of the SH post.

He called out the Liberals for their selective treatment of our Colvin vs Mulroney. Your denial and attempts to change channels has failed.

I see you struggle with honesty in every post. Filled with "hate" for the current government and their agenda. You can run and hide behind your pattern of smears and pretend outside the "clown car brigade" you have any support. You are simply parroting a party without any moral high ground for many years. It must painful and very upsetting watching a decline from 2000-2008 of 13% support. In 2008 the CPC outraised all opposition parties combined.
You should be ashamed, but as Bob Rae once said the Liberals have no shame, they are shameless.

The opposition have again chosen to smear the good names of our sons and daughters trying to score points.

Ha ha ha.

Good one. Way to prove my point.

Personal attack, again, Gayle. Have you changed your stance on the invalidity of personal attacks?

East - I have tried to explain this to you many times. People who resort to personal attacks, without anything else, demonstrate they know they have no real response to the argument.

I do not care about people who insult me. I simply point it out when they use the insult in a lame attempt to cover up the fact they have nothing else to say.

I generally have plenty to say.

Now, if YOU are taking issue with personal attacks, will you be consistent and chide Liz and CS as well?

Gayle - you reply in a similar fashion when asked to prove or show a link. Your response is along the lines of your not wishing to do others' work for them. So, turnabout fair play.

Stop mischaracterizing my previous comments. When I assert something I back it up.

CS was wrong about what she or he was asserting. That part is obvious.

It's really astounding the opposition would be playing this type of juvenile, dangerous politics. The Liberals would like us to believe they're fit to govern but their actions tell us loud and clear they are far from it.

Mr Colvin is their man, they won't accept as fact any other testimony, just Colvin's. Why? Let's say they're on yet another gotcha gong show, hoping to defame the Forces and the government, mainly to incriminate the Harper government. That's the bottom line.

The stupidity, the dangerous stupidity, in all of this is we are at war and cannot divulge sensitive information that would affect the safety of our forces and those they protect. The opposition have proven they cannot be trusted.

The NDP are consistent, they don't believe in fighting any war. The Liberals are becoming amorphous blobs, they appear to have lost their capacity to recall it was their man JC who sent the troops to Afghanistan without proper equipment for even basic safety, green camouflage for the desert and very poor equipment, in some cases they had to borrow from others on the mission. Now they're all worried about the Taliban who float among the people, wearing no uniform and simply set roadside bombs or do the suicide bomb exercise they're famous for, killing our troops and innocent civilians.

It's a total disgrace to witness this in our country. With our Forces and government being accused of war crimes by these foolish people who sit in opposition in the HOC our PM should address the nation.
In the first and second world wars enemy sympathizers would not be tolerated and there were far less communications in those days, intelligence wasn't easily procured.

What you should be doing is focusing your anger on the government who has been lying to us and trying to cover it up ever since.

They are the ones who have hurt our international reputation, scarred the mission in Afghanistan and put our troops at risk.

I know it goes against your nature as a conservative to hold anyone you agree with responsible for their actions, but for the sake of our country I suggest you try.

Gayle,for the sake of Canada ,quit donating money to the Liberal Party.

That's a good suggestion. I've decided to let Squeaky rant on with her superiority complex in overdrive. Poor thing can't stand the Liberal blogs, they're just aren't up to her superior intellect.
I'd tell her to go crap in her hat but I can't provide a link.

BTW, bocanut, how do you suppose Iggy and the Clowns will vote on the question of HST to be introduced in the HOC next week? It's not a matter of confidence either. Guess who's the genius, only one guess!

Gayle, you are obviously a Liberal Party supporter and this is supposedly a Conservative blog site. Equally obvious is your intention to disrupt and distort anything said here. Your favourite backup ploy is to ask for a reference as if the entire world carries around references to satisfy you "need" to know everything in a precise manner. I have a suggestion: why not find a nice Liberal Party blog site and then you find nothing to upset you because obviously the Liberals never tell lies or distort any facts. Failing that, why don't you put on a blindfold and go play in traffice.

Nah. I say stick around Gayle. You're welcome to comment here. Anyone is, as long as they keep it civil.

Dosanjh is quite the character. I find it amusing that the LPC comprises spokespersons who should have retreated long ago. Bob Rae who ruined Ontario for generations now seems to have risen to a position of promininence within the LPC. Dosanjh, who comes out with the most outrageous statements seems to speak for the party. Ignatieff, who waffles more than the Eggo plant, is the leader of this party. It's mind-boggling.

As for Afghan-gate: our troops are in a foreign country as guest (or interlopers) and are trying to get the country to right itself, somehow. If Afghans are ALLEGEDLY torturing fellow Afghans, there really is not a whole heck of a lot we can do about it. As for embarrasing out country - I am one Canadian who is NOT embarrassed by this incident save for the fact that we have a diplomat who is indescreetly airing his dirty laundry for all and sundry to see. That is embarrassing. That former CPC member who is no longer running as a Liberal...his behaviour is embarrassing. An opposition leader who waffles all over the map and makes the most ridiculour statements is embarrassing. An opposition leader who is, basically, an American is embarrassing. Dosanjh is embarrassing.

My own take on Afghanistan is that we should not be there. I do not support sending our troops over there to die for a country which refuses to become democratic. I also think that those of us who are not in Afghanistan and who do not have first-hand knowledge of the situation, should be criticizing our country for ALLEGEDLY sending Afghans into the hands of fellow Afghan ALLEGED torturers.

You get that no one is criticizing the troops, right?

Red Cross rebukes diplomat over Afghan torture allegations
-By Matthew Fisher, Canwest News ServiceNovember 29, 2009

Ottawa’s ambassador to Afghanistan, William Crosbie, said Saturday that “nobody” from an international group responsible for the human rights of detainees “has contacted me or anyone at the embassy regarding anything alleging something involving Canadians in Afghanistan.”

Two senior Canadian military officers in Afghanistan who did not wish to be identified because of confidentiality obligations that Canada has with those responsible for detainees’ welfare, said they had never heard of the suspicions that any of their members had violated humanitarian law conventions here.

Although detainees do not meet the prisoner-of-war criteria as set out in the Geneva Conventions, Canada has chosen to treat them as such.
canada.com/news/Cross+rebukes+diplomat+over+Afghan+torture+allegations/2282914/story.html