Ironic press release of the day

The Liberal Party put out this release today:

OTTAWA –The Harper government must stop their ongoing complicity in human rights abuses against Omar Khadr by bringing him back to Canada, Liberal MPs said today.

“An independent report has just found that Canada’s spy agency failed to take human rights concerns into account when interrogating Mr. Khadr,” said Liberal Consular Affairs Critic Dan McTeague. “This finding strengthens the case for bringing Mr. Khadr home and calls for stronger government oversight on how CSIS conducts its business.”

SIRC, which is the oversight body that monitors the work of CSIS on behalf of Parliament, reported this week that CSIS ignored human rights concerns when interrogating Omar Khadr at Guantanamo Bay prison.

Ah yes, who was the minister responsible for CSIS at the time of Omar Khadr’s interrogation? Khadr was interrogated and filmed by CSIS during February 2003. Wayne Easter was solicitor general of the Liberal government at the time.

Here’s CP:

OTTAWA — Canada’s spy watchdog says the Canadian Security Intelligence Service may need major changes after finding it ignored concerns about human rights and Omar Khadr’s young age in deciding to interview the Toronto-born teen at a U.S. military prison.

By Liberal logic, if the “Harper government” is complicit to human rights abuses by not bringing Khadr home, the Liberals are most complicit for having ministerial oversight over CSIS when the alleged abuse took place.

And then, the Liberals go on to lecture the Conservatives (their leader is a human rights expert, so I’m told):

Liberal Foreign Affairs Critic Bob Rae said the Harper government’s record on standing up for Canadian citizens abroad shows that they either don’t care about the expectations of a “contemporary democratic society,” or they don’t understand them.

“Whatever the case, it is unacceptable, and their complicity in human rights violations around the world must stop,” said Mr. Rae, adding that Public Safety Minister Peter Van Loan’s response to the report was highly inadequate. “Our laws make it very clear how Mr. Khadr should have been treated. Clearly, there needs to be better oversight on how CSIS conducts its business overseas. And clearly he must be brought home.”

Comments

comments

  • east of eden

    Uh, I remember Trudeau coming into power when I was graduating high school. Considering that it was at the beginning of the 1970s, I believe that the baby boom was over. I was born in 1953 – around the middle of the boom and by the time I graduated high school, the early boomers were already producing a new generation.

    I see you used yet another of Gayle's lines in your comment. Gayle, however, never used stupid names like Flatulence and Harpo – for that, I'll give her credit.

  • Gabby in QC

    East of Eden, Andrew Coyne wrote an interesting essay on Trudeau's deficits called “Social Spending,Taxes, and the Debt.”
    http://andrewcoyne.com/essays/BookChapters/Trud

    Here are some interesting excerpts:
    • Net federal debt in fiscal 1968, just before Trudeau became Prime Minister, was about $18-billion, or 26 per cent of gross domestic product; by his final year in office, it had ballooned to $206-billion — at 46 per cent of GDP, nearly twice as large relative to the economy.

    • The years from fiscal 1976 to fiscal 1985 were, fiscally speaking, a lost decade: ten straight years in which the government ran not only an overall deficit, but an operating deficit. The overall deficit throughout this later phase never fell below 3 per cent of GDP; it averaged 5.6 per cent. In that calamitous final year of Liberal rule, 1984-85, total spending exceeded revenues by more than 50 per cent.

    • No wonder the Liberals' successors had such trouble bringing the debt to heel. Summing across the nine years of Conservative [Mulroney] government, the federal government actually spent about $14-billion less on programs than it collected in revenues. Every dollar of the $300-billion added to the debt during the Tory years was interest on the debt the Liberals left behind.

    And Jeffrey Simpson, who was quoted here to support an anti-Harper POV, wrote this in his recent column “Our politicians take the easy way out and leave us with the bill.” http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/ou
    “Canadians have seen this movie before, and it wasn't pretty. Deficits started in 1975. They were thought then to be “temporary,” a tonic against slow growth. For the next two decades, in good times and bad, under Liberal and Conservative governments, there were always reasons why tomorrow, not today, was preferable to doing something serious.”

    Mind you, it's an exercise in futility to convince rabid Liberal supporters that their hero left Mulroney's government a huge debt to deal with, regardless of who writes about it.

    I'm sure someone will chirp in saying Andrew Coyne is nothing but a Conservative hack, yet will turn around and immediately quote him as an authority whenever he slags PM Harper.

    Anyway, some people try to rewrite history to suit their own purpose, so maybe it's better to leave them to their rantings … but, no matter how they try, they can't change the past.

  • terry1

    For your own information I ahve lived in and visited every middle eastern Country over the last 35 years and still go there at least once a year. My hosts yesterday at a party are Lebanese and my best friend in Montreal still has a house in Lebanon and it was he who clearly pointed fingers at the Harpercrites for their misstaken efforts during the problems there.

    Calling people a bigot openly w/o cause is actually ignorant and an apology is in order. You cannot even begin construe my comments as bigotry and if you did I ahve cleared that up. Then again you are a typical angry tory who thinks everyone else is wrong.

  • terry1

    The baby boom years FYI were from 1946 to 1965 and those people were all needing massive new education and infrastructure facilities all throughout the Trudeau years. Where else did he spend the money if not on a fast growing Country?

    Why don't you read up on thiss stuff instead of spewing garbage like you do.

  • terry1

    Gabby, how about using material other than reporters with a lsant as you so often accuse me of doing.
    Thee are several much more academic studies of the baby boomer period frommwhich to glean the reasons behind the issues of the day. Your typical narrow minded view comes into focus very easily whern real research is done.
    http://www.infc.gc.ca/research-recherche/result
    “Several factors contributed to the constantly growing infrastructure problems, including the pressure on the budgets due to the economic recession, some post-Second World War infrastructure reaching the end of its service life, rapid inflation of the late 1970´s,”

  • hundredthmeridian

    Well, the Libs did pilfer $54 BB from EI and then channelled it into general rev's to make it look like we had a surplus!

  • hundredthmeridian

    Well, I don't see any criticism of the Libs / Wayne Easter's handling of this file by you anywhere, so that implies to me you had no problem with it back then, and likely would still not have a problem with it – or at the very least, not being publicly critical over it – if your beloved, elitist, almighty party were in government .

  • Gabby in QC

    And those two references are relevant because … ???

    This thread WAS about the patriation of Omar Khadr.
    You've gone all over the map, as usual, polluting this site with your pedestrian pustules – not to mention your pompous preening about your connections to the Laurier Club et al..

    Yes, yes, I know … “Gabby the lone angry Quebec reformatory blah blah blah …”

  • lauriercluboccassionalwaitress

    Chretien/Martin illegally drained $54 billion from the stand alone EI fund and put it in general revenues to reduce the deficit. Now you say it is a correct move because Harpers gov´t has not put it back. Wow you are blindfoldrd for sure. One can accept the Liberals backtracking on re-instating a 7% GST or not repealing NAFTA. We grudgingly accept that there will be no real justice for the $100 million dollars the federal Liberal Party, in brazen outright corruption, papered favoured Quebec political ridings, advertising agencies and pet Liberals with in brown paper bags. One is still relieved that the Liberals shameless myopia almost cause Quebec to actually separate from Canada. In my mind one of the most shameful things that the Liberals did was beginning in 1993 they completely, totally stopped funding low income housing in all of Canada. One of the most devastating acts in their fiscal downloading to the provinces in order to appear to be debt gurus. Our inner cities are suffering badly. Of course you would never admit that the Conservative gov´t has already begun to try to make this social housing disaster right. To you terrytune, it is all about vilifying the enemy and that is why you do not get it. Facts and spin. The latter is more fun than facing reality. Now terrytune go ahead and have your last word. Everyone now can see that you have little else to do, but spin the Liberal yarn.

  • memyselfandnoother

    The Khadr family was flown first class from Pakistan to Toronto all paid for by the Liberal govt of Canada as a reward for killing Americans.
    Nice, eh?!

    I have lots of titbits on this “favorite family of Canadian media”. Might write a book one day that will make honest folks throw up with disgust at their Leftist parties.

  • `Liz J

    It's amazing to me how Jean Chretien fell in love with the Khadr family, even went to visit him in a Pakistan hospital then when the “child soldier” of that terrorist supporting family got hauled off to Gitmo , accused of killing an American medic, they did nothing about bringing the darling “home” during their ensuing four years in power. Why? They did polling and found out most Canadians do not want him or any of his family in Canada period.

    Was Jean Chretien that far out of the loop on the intelligence file?

    Sadly, these parasitic residents of this country are cheering while our soldiers are fighting and dying at the hands of the same terrorists the Khadrs support. They are family friends of Osama Bin Laden. Why is anyone in this country concerning themselves with how our American allies are treating the kid his family reared for terror. His mother said on National TV she would be proud to have her sons martyr themselves for their cause.

  • Omanator

    Liz , your are so dead on. I don't want these people in Canada either. They are living off our tax dollars. Not working no way. Yes, all the Liberals love it, because they themselves have questionalble ethics.

  • Richard

    Liz, East, Gabby … please stop encouraging this fool who calls herself Terry1.
    My index finger is almost sprained from all this scroling past her endless name-calling and asinine ramblings.
    Please, even Gayle brought a higher level of intelligent debate that this clown, if nothing else she didn’t resort to this infantile name calling that Terry1 seems to have to resort to.
    If fact, reading Terry1’s comments, I kind of miss Gayle.

  • Richard

    Liz, East, Gabby … please stop encouraging this fool who calls herself Terry1.
    My index finger is almost sprained from all this scroling past her endless name-calling and asinine ramblings.
    Please, even Gayle brought a higher level of intelligent debate that this clown, if nothing else she didn’t resort to this infantile name calling that Terry1 seems to have to resort to.
    If fact, reading Terry1’s comments, I kind of miss Gayle.

  • terry1

    At least read your own posts before you look so stupid. Your post abovve mine refers to Trudeaus deficits and I responded on topic.

    Too bad you're so busy looking hard for Tory positives whci are hard to find.

  • terry1

    Show us your references,please or stop rumour mongering. You sound like a tory war room persona.

  • terry1

    Omanator, your responses are so stupid you should possibly not be in Canada either.

  • terry1

    Liz J hysterical while you rail on about so called lib follies you should be reiminded about who ahs ruled this country for the last 40 years almost always in a majority position.

    Since 1963, a period of 46 years, the Libs have served this country as the government for almost 34 out of those years.

    In the last election many liberals sat on their votes and the Tory vote declined. It would seem probable that the electorate in Canada does not support the current tories by a probable 70% to 30%.

    Canada has become one of the top five countries in the world during this period of majority liberal rule.

    Canada repatriated control over its own legal destiny during this period while the Tories created the Bloc during Mulroneys ill advisewd meech lake accord.

    So all your preaching looks pretty stupid considering the real facts.

  • terry1

    Foaming at the mouth (laurier club waitress)
    “Chretien/Martin illegally drained $54 billion from the stand alone EI fund and put it in general revenues to reduce the deficit. Now you say it is a correct move because Harpers gov´t has not put it back. “
    1. The so called theft was an accounting issue dealt with very smartly by Martin and avoided the government going to the debt markets to support general revenues. You wouldn't understand that because you are obviously of a socialist mindest. No one was deprived of EI as a result of that. EI is just another tax like GST in effect and I see no reaon for thsoe funds to be held in separate accounts when there is national debt to pay down. Then again you won't get it.
    ……………………………
    “We grudgingly accept that there will be no real justice for the $100 million dollars the federal Liberal Party, in brazen outright corruption, papered favoured Quebec political ridings, advertising agencies and pet Liberals with in brown paper bags

    1. There were no Liberal MP's ever charged and knowing how revengful and distasteful this current government is they would have searched high and low for more dirt. The way Harper treats Civil servants you might see a worse scandal in this government sooner or later.
    2. Harper took $1BB of OUR money and handed it to Charest just before his election in 2007 who in turn used it to give all quebeckers a tax cut. That was the real robbery.
    …………………………………………….
    “One is still relieved that the Liberals shameless myopia almost cause Quebec to actually separate from Canada”
    1. the biggest cause of quebec's near separation was the Meech lake disaster. Mulroney played a crap shoot and lost. The result was the Bloc Quebecois that haunts us still.
    2. The Liberals actually passed the one law that makes it almost impossible for them to separate and that was the clarity act pushed forth by Stephane Dion.
    …………………………………
    Thank you for allowing me to further villify the party that has only been in government for about 12 of the last 46 years during which Canada became the best Country in the world. In fact it only took those 12 years in total to create most of our recent national debt surge, reduced the progressive Conservatives to 2 seats and forced them to merge with right wing zealots who are clearly wrong for Canada as it will be shown in the next few months.

  • terry1

    Liz J hysterical, I agree with your snyopsis of that family. But, please tell me where the selection of who is Canadian and who isn't stops. That is the main point in this discussion not the criminals tatus of Khadr. Maybe you would like it if mass murderers here in Canadian prisons, all Canadians, were shipped to some gulag in Siberia. That, once again shows your absolute and typical ignorance of the actual situation.

    Your nasty Tory comments about Chretien are all BS. If Khadr was subsequently charged with murder after the fact, our government only had the repsonsibility ro ensure he received a fair trial. The US has spent millions to date providing him with legal support since 2003.

  • terry1

    Of course your selective memory or copying needs to be challenged, so, from the same essay:
    ” The most significant early measure was the 1973 indexation of the personal income tax system, adjusting both personal exemptions and tax brackets each year to keep pace with increases in the consumer price index. By and large, this was good public policy: Failure to index the system had exposed taxpayers to “bracket creep” as inflation mounted in the late 1960s and early 1970s. In effect, this allowed the government to raise taxes without seeking Parliament's authority. Yet if indexation was a praiseworthy move, it was no less costly: a Finance Department study put the revenue loss in 1979 alone at $6-billion, or about one-third of personal income tax revenues in that year.
    Other tax measures introduced around the same time included the three personal income tax cuts enacted from 1973 through 1975, increases in personal and employment expense deductions, the $1000 interest income deduction, and the investment tax credit. Then there was the $1000 deduction for pension income, the radical expansion of the Registered Retirement Savings Plan program in 1972, and the Registered Home Ownership Savings Plan (RHOSP). Most important of all was the 1978 Child Tax Credit, providing parents with a basic payment of $200 per child per year. If not quite a guaranteed annual income, it had much in it that resembled its close relative, the negative income tax: the benefit was delivered through the tax system, a first in Canada, and varied with family income. This was much in keeping with the bureaucratic preference for the “building blocks” approach to income security over a full-blown GAI. Just as the Guaranteed Income Supplement added an income-tested boost to the universal Old Age Security program, the child tax credit now did the same for family allowances. (In recent years, these two-headed programs have been rationalized into, respectively, the Seniors' Benefit and Child Tax Benefit.)”

    I would ask the troy troubador Gabby to suggest which of the programs have the Tories killed off. The answer is none and in fact Harpo has copied Trudeau by creating the TFSA program. Harpos deficits are growing faster than any of Trudeau's although it is too early to ratify that.

    In his essay Coyne does not get into population demographics, such as the numbers of young people entering the work force and/or advanced education or the growth in infrastructure needs that preceeded the government's ability to collect taxes because of the baby boom.

    In closing here is another pice from that same essay:
    “Canada is certainly a more Just Society than it was when Trudeau made his pledge: there is less poverty; more go on to higher education; medical insurance is universal. “

    I think that speaks for itself as to his legacy.

  • Gabby in QC

    Too bad you didn't copy the full ending paragraph. I think that speaks to YOUR truthiness rather than to my “selective memory or copying.”
    “Canada is certainly a more Just Society than it was when Trudeau made his pledge: there is less poverty; more go on to higher education; medical insurance is universal. But, thirty years and half a trillion dollars in debt later, the promise is unfulfilled.

    And that ending paragraph was Coyne's way of reaffirming the POV he advanced in the opening paragraph, which reads:
    For a prime minister first elected on the promise of The Just Society, Pierre Trudeau's legacy in the field of social policy is surprisingly modest. The ninefold increase in federal spending he oversaw between 1968 and 1984 might be expected to have purchased some comparable advance in social justice. Yet the social policy achievements of the four governments he led can only be described as piecemeal.

    So keep nurturing your paranoia about PM Harper and the Conservatives, and keep up the torrent of coarse epithets. You learned those tactics at the Laurier Club? How urbane of you! How classy!

  • east of eden

    Hmmm, I don't recall those double digits happening the Mulroney years. But, hey, I'm not Liberal so my vision is actually clear.

  • `Liz J

    Maybe most of them don't know about the designation of “child soldier” among them the glorified Liberal Senator Romeo Dallaire who has declared him to have been exactly that. It's very convenient for them to have his expert opinion to feed their agenda on this matter. What's really not making any sense is who are they playing to beyond the extreme Left who lack all capacity for reasoned thought? How many Khadr sympathizers are there in Toronto to net them many votes?

  • Rich

    Terry your unmitigated Liberal bias is really astounding. First it was the Great PET that divided east and west. The introduction of the disastrous National Energy Policy (NEP): That devastated the Oil Industry in Western Canada, I know because my job was in that industry.

    Second the Mortgage interest rate during the Trudeau years was around 18% and people lost their homes ,

    Third 80% of the national debt was the direct responsibility of PET which Brian Mulroney inherited that is why he introduced the GST which was to pay down that debt. By the way John Turner and Jean Chretien both campaigned against that tax and said that they would get rid of it, this was back in 1988 election and again in the 1994 election. It was the Liberals under JC that tightened the rules on EI making it harder for umemployed workers to collect; it was the Liberals that took the EI fund, put it in to general revenues to be used as they desired. It was the Liberals that put Canadian forces into Afghanistan without debate in Parliament and with shoddy equipment. It was the Liberals that put a contingent of Canadian forces into Iraq under the watch of John McCallum the Defense Minister at the time. All the time Chretien was telling the Canadian public how he stood up to Bush.

    It was the Liberals that introduce the anti-terrorist act under which Khadr was detained, and the Liberals did nothing about Khadr.

  • Gabby in QC

    OK … what the heck happened?

    I logged in to your site, saw the instruction “view comments” instead of the usual number, clicked on it, and saw all the comments in a different font, listed in chronological order with dates and times of posting.

    I posted a comment congratulating you on the new look, clicked on “post comment” and waited for the comment to show.
    What did I see?
    The old format.

    What happened?

  • Rich

    Gabby: well said, Terry needs to think a bit, the reason that Chretien had three majority governments in th 90's was due to the Canadian Alliance and the old PC party splitting the right of center vote; With the unification of these two parties, Mr Harper has eliminated that split; that is one reason that the current liberal party constantly tries to drive a wedge between the old PC members and the Reformers as Terry calls them: Hence you get certain conservatives like Scott Brison, Belinda Stronach & David Orchard Keith Martin crossing the floor. While the two Conservative Parties united, the liberal parties is trying to move more into NDP territory with bring memebers like Bob Rae and Ujjal Dosanjh. This has caused the Liberals to lose the center/center right to Mr. Harper

  • Rich

    Hi Gabby great reporting, there is nothing left to be said. Thanks

  • Rich

    Terry we cannot pick and choose who we allow to keep our passports, but when a new immigrant takes the oath of allegiance before a citizenship judge, he or she agrees to abide by the laws and rights of Canada, and if that person contravenes those laws or rights, he or she should not be allowed to retain that citizenship. I know, because I came to Canada because of the life that Canada could offer to me, Liberty, justice and democracy. THese are unalienable rights and should not be abused.

  • terry1

    Rich, the only reason Harpo won anything was because of adscam and the Libs lost votes in quebec. The split on the left continues also therefore allowing harpo to win minority status.

    This country was not managed by Liberals for 34 out of the last 46 years because they were bad managers. The reformatories have done their damage to the country's morale and its time fr the Libs to take it back and rebuild that self confidence.

    Iggy is not running on the left. His statements so far are all to the center of the spectrum to halt Harpos efforts there. He has his left wing that will continue to harvest votes on that side as well and.that appears to be paying off also.

    And don't kid yourself the progressives have knives out for Harpo and will get him sooner than later as they want control of their party back after McKay's betrayal.

  • terry1

    If Mulroney was PM in 1984 than interest rates were at 10% and higher. Mortgages were still going for around 12% in 85. Worldwide inflation did not die down until a couple of years later.

  • terry1

    When Coyne becomes known as an historian we will believe his newspaper talents. In the meantime there have been other much more flattering writings about PET and he remains the most popular former PM in the public's eye.

  • terry1

    Rich, I don't disagree with your comment but the law of the land does not say that someone can lose their citizenship becauee of criminal activity. We have a duty to understand what being a Canadian is and if its used to create chaos then maybe a new rule needs to be in place.

  • Gabby in QC

    Stephen!

    Congratulations on your new cleaner, crisper, and chronologically updated look.

    I hate to gush but … I really, really like it.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Another day, more rationale from Terry of why Canadians have to accept extreme Liberal views as 'Canadian'.

  • terry1

    B&P….maybe if you got off your ar$e instead of collecting harpos welfare you might understand some of this stuff.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Terry – it just speaks to priorities and is one of many reasons why Canadians have overwhelmingly REJECTED the Liberal$ and their agenda the last two elections.

    Our PM is worried about getting our economy moving – not about Omar Khadir.

    Paul Martin was on record listing dozens of things as 'priorities' during his time as PM. No doubt this would be another if the Liberal$ were in power.

  • terry1

    B&P………”Overwhelmingly rejected”

    Wow………Harpo barely squeeked by in the first election and he still has a minority and is not in the lead right now. Give your head a shake. 65% of all canadians reject Harpo. Remember that fact beczuse it will grow to 75% by the next election.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Terry – MILLIONS fewer Canadians voted Liberal last election relative to previous elections. Harper's margin of victory over the Liberal$ was more than 3 TIMES greater than Obama's over McCain.

  • east of eden

    Wrong. Sixty-five percent of those eligible voters who bothered to vote did not vote Conservative. How in the world can you say that 65% of all voters rejected Mr. Harper? As far as I know, people under 18 cannot vote so there goes your 65% right off the bat. As for the people who did vote, only a small percentage actually voted.

    Now, are you saying that people who checked off Liberal, for example, were not actually voting FOR the Liberals but, instead, AGAINST Mr. Harper. I don't think so, Terry.

    Your comment is foolish and incredibly incorrect. Sixty-five percent of all Canadians – good Lord, that is the stupidest thing you've ever written and, given how stupid your comments are…

  • terry1

    E of E….the foolish one here is you. Face facts Canadians do not like the right wing as espoused by Harpo. The rest of your stuff is simply hysterical rambling.

  • Bugszy

    Two wrongs don't make it right East. The Liberals are not the ones in power now so where the hell are theReformed Cons on this matter. Right the wrongs that were done in the past and for gods sake, if the cons want credibility they need to grow up and quit blaming the past for their own short comings and start doing something to correct those wrongs. The Reform/Cons would do a lot more to gain respect if they quit stalling and fix the problem instead of contributing to it. Is that to musch to expect? Simple matter, simple solutions. Fix it darn it.

  • terry1

    Bugszy, asking reformatories to do something other dither and hope another election doesn't happen soon is too much for this bankrupt group.

  • Rich

    Terry nice try but a little over the top, 65% of all Canadians did not support Mr Harper well please tell me how many Canadians actually supported Paul Martin in the Conservatives first election and how many supported Stephane Dion in Mr Harper' s second election. Remember Paul Martin inherited a majority government from Chretien and in his first election he reduce that to a minority government that lasted one year and Martin was relegated to the opposition benches. Next election the Liberals where lead by Stephane Dion (father of the Clarity act) and further reduced the Liberals to 77 seats the lowest showing for a Liberal party. The reason Mr Harper did not get a majority was because of the Bloc in Quebec and artists complaining about a funding cut of 45 million from a budget of 1 billion dollars. The Bloc will also hurt the Liberal Party in Quebec.

    How can you justify making the statement that 65% of Canadians did not vote Conservative when the entire voter turn out for the last election was only 59%. It is not the Prime Minister fault if the Canadian public chose not to exercise the given right to vote.

    secondly Stephane Dion did not even receive less than 50% of the vote in his riding alone, not to mention that the Liberal vote dropped to about 25% so by your calculations 75% Canadians did not vote Liberal.

    As for Mr Harper losing support, where is Mr Ignatieff, what are his policies?

  • `Liz J

    We can all recall the sight of a desperate, frenetic P Martin crossing the country spreading lies about Stephen Harper. In the dying days of the campaign he had the gall to say Stephen Harper didn't have Canadian values, implying only Liberals hold Canadian values. He wrongly thought the people of Canada would swallow that one, it was possibly the last straw for many, they caught on to his game of spreading lies. He had all the finesse of the quintessential snake oil salesman, booming voice, aid for all, the Natives, Health care, child care, seniors, immigrants and on and on. Just a little too good to be true as in, we've heard it all before.

    Martin was the architect of his own demise. He spent about a decade coveting the top job and plotting how he would get rid of Wile E. Coyote instead of paying attention to what was going on in the wider scope of things. It was all about himself. Wile E. stepped aside,pushed out, whatever, after he did his little thing on party funding, Martin got his wish for power then had no idea what to do with it. He was a disaster. They got Dion, a disaster. They now are about to repeat with a third disaster as the cards are being played out now. None of the old stalwarts of any significance are coming forward to be part of this agony of defeat.

    The best they have is really down to “Shit from Hell” emanating from a war room somewhere.

    Sure, this is OT, but that's what happens when trolls have nothing better to do than park their arses here and take over with insults.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Terry – actually those are not the facts at all. The facts are:

    - 37% of voters voted conservative last election

    - Conservatives are currently leading in BC, Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba and Ontario. (EKOS – July 12)

    - MILLIONS fewer voters cast a vote for the Liberal$ last election

    Maybe check out the definition of 'fact' before you attach this word to 'Terry's Opinion'.

    Otherwise, don't be surprised when you don't get a response

  • `Liz J

    We should also remember the guts of the “Clarity Act” came from Preston Manning and Stephen Harper. Dion and the Liberals did a little tinkering with it and claimed it as their own. So damned typical of the Liberals, they steal ideas and give no attribution.

  • lauriercluboccassionalwaitress

    Excellent synopsis Lizj. Odd that terry-1 would use the ridiculous old NDP saw that 60 some percent of Canadians did not vote for the Conservatives. In using that thinking, the greater blasphemy would be not mentioning that Chretien, in receiving his huge majority, only garnered 37.5% of the votes across Canada. Hence a majority gained with over 62% of Canadians (voters actually) NOT voting for the Liberals. But for terrytune the math is Liberal math. The Liberals were ensured their victories at a time when the conservative movement was fragmented and in a reorganizing and renewal process. This was after conservatives, NOT just liberals decisively voted out Mulroney/Campbell. Under no circumstance would a Liberal do such a thing to their own politicians. So Conservatives then began the process of rebuilding their policies and programs, a need unseen by old school Liberals. Conservatives will vote out their own if necessary and seek renewal while Liberals fail to see their own faults and under no circumstances would they punish their own, just keep holding your nose, put on the blindfold and vote for the same Liberals. It would be sad if it were not so pathetic.

  • `Liz J

    Yeah, Conservatives will vote out their own if necessary, we've proven that one. We have principles that trump power. The Liberals are willing to foist anything on the people to seize power,it's all about themselves in the trough, not what they can do for the good of the Country. For proof of that we need only go back to recent history and the coalition of the desperate.

    It remains to be seen how long they can count on brain free voting as has been the norm in, for instance, Toronto, for too long fueled by fear mongering with outright lies.

  • terry1

    the reformatories won 37% of the lowest turnout in federal election history. people simply sat on their hands rather than vote for either party including over 800,000 liberal voters which is why we now have a winnable leader in Iggy. The party got the message loud and clear that people didn't want Harpo but wanted the Liberals to upgrade their leadership which has been done.