For your consideration

I’ve learned that this is what the Conservative Party MPs will be sending out in short order regarding Michael Ignatieff and his previous comments about the Ukraine and Ukrainians.

The ten-percenter shows the now famous image of the Liberal Party leader from the Just Visiting ad series.

It includes two Ignatieff quotes:

“Ukrainian independence conjures up images of embroidered peasant shirts, the nasal whine of ethnic instruments, phoney Cossacks in cloaks and boots, nasty anti-Semites” – Blood and Belonging p. 73, 1993

“Somewhere inside I’m also what Ukrainians would call a great Russian and there is just a trace of old Russian disdain for these little Russians.” – Blood and Belonging p. 81, 1993

Comments

comments

  • Bugszy

    Well Stephen, my shorts are not in a knot and I am not surprised by your response. You are one of the blind supporters and in my view, that makes you as much a loser as Harper is. And by the way, those quotes you talk about that we are receiving are pure fabrication on the Reform con artists and I am far from impressed. Canadians are not as blind as your leader thinks they are and just might work against him. If the Liberls wanted to and I'll use the word loosly; wanted to ATTACK Harper, they would have a lot of credible proven material to do so. As for the 10% ers, try and understand that the country is not in an election campaign and we are getting these attack ads from MPs in other provinces on our tax dollars. I'll be damnned if I want to pay for their made up statements in dirty campaign attacks that are not even the truth. BTW, I still will send the ones I receive to the Govener General and let her deal with that matter. If enough of Canadians do that, we will see results. I do not expect a reply from you so don't even bother to reply. Harper and his Reform Con artist have done a lot of dirty politics since they have been in power and they will pay the price in the end.

  • albertabob

    No, not as deep, but I try. It's nice to hear you contribute. You seem to be one of the few that puts their money where their mouth is.

  • albertabob

    Etobicoke-Centre. My old riding, before I moved west.

  • http://www.stephentaylor.ca Stephen Taylor

    Welcome to the internet Bugszy. You'll note that I didn't respond to your comment above… hollinm did.

  • terry1

    good for you Bugzy!!!

  • joannetb

    Well, that's a good point Mecheng.

    As long as everything is truthful, then there really shouldn't be a problem.

  • hollinm

    terry1…Trudeau at least was a Canadian and had been in politics. Iggy
    never had any interest in the country. Where was he in the Medicare debate
    or when the flag debate was going on? Where was his support for the
    federalists in the 1995 referendum? Where was his pronouncements on Free
    Trade which probably was one of the most significant policy discussions
    since confederation? What vision does he have for the country and why did he
    come back if it was not to enhance his resume? What is his economic
    experience? I could go on and on but you get the drift.

    Talking about an issue and raising questions with no answers like all good
    professors do may appear very intellectual but really we have no idea
    whether he can lead the country. The fact he is not Stephen Harper is not
    getting to win the next election for the Liberals.

    Iggy has hit a brick wall. His poll numbers are frozen at 32-34% and when
    Canadians are asked about his leadership abilities and his ability to manage
    the economy Harper beats him hands down.

    So you can belong to the Laurier club and preach the Liberal gospel but
    seriously ordinary Canadians have taken the measure of the man and find him
    lacking.

  • terry1

    Mervin, Trudeau was recruited by Pearson in 1964 to be the next leader which he became in 1967. ,if my memory serves me well. Iggy was recruited by Martin in 2005 to be the next leader which he became in 2009…do you get the jist of it now?

    Why should Iggy be spouting policy when he is smiply the opposition leader and there is no election. You reformers are simply trying to play “rope a dope”. It won't work as Iggy is heads and shoulders above that and won't make the same mistake as Dion did.
    If Harpoon simply thought about governing instead of walking around with his huge hard on for the Libs we could possibly have had better solutions to the recessionary period we are in.

    Iggy has not ht a wall as you suggest….its summer and the PM has been getting all the press lately. That's the wall and its very traditional that the ruling party's numbers go up when there is nothing to screw up. But don't worry September is coming and the generalissimo will be back screwing up as usual….if he doesn't retire before then.

    The laurier club has a very long history in Canada and the liberal party and we're proud to be part of it. Too bad you don't belong to anything but the angry Tory whiners club….LOL

  • Richard

    just out of curiousity, Bugszy, what exactly do you think the GG’s going to do?
    Bring the PM into her office and give him a stern talking to?
    Tell him he’s now on double secret probation?

    There’s nothing illegal about sending out 10%ers. They’ve been used by a certain past MP to promote his book.

    At least this is information that’s beneficial to the public.

  • hollinm

    Remember it is Iggy who wants to be PM. Harper already has the job. He will
    have to say something meaningful soon or the media will turn on him. He
    cannot get away with simply criticizing and not offering any suggestions. In
    fact if you look at how the leader of the opposition's job is described it
    states clearly that the opposition's responsibility is to offer alternatives
    to the government. Iggy is the one playing rope a dope and if he thinks a
    campaign is where he should offer his policies he is in for a rude
    awakening. 36 days is not a lot of time in a busy campaign period.

    Iggy hurt himself significantly in the last week of parliament by
    threatening an election that he nor the party were ready for. Harper did not
    want one either that is clear. However, Harper has now ensnared Iggy on EI
    reform. Iggy will wear whatever changes are made good or bad. However,
    remember if they decide to establish a national standard across the country
    you better hope that it is lower (not likely) than what is currently in the
    Maritimes now. The Libs lost the Maritimes once before for screwing around
    with their EI.

    terry1 to any dispassionate observer Iggy comes across as elitist, arrogant
    and as my adult son said a blowhard. My the way my children hate politics
    and roll their eyes every time I try to talk about it. So when there is
    something in the news and I mention it to test to see if they have heard
    about it i.e. wafer, Raitt, Gays etc they simply roll their eyes and say
    they could care less. I suspect many Canadians are doing the same thing.
    Watching the Liberals jockeying to win brownie points and looking foolish in
    the process.

    Pearson did not look outside the country for a successor. Trudeau was
    already an MP and lets not forget he was democratically elected at a
    convention vis a vis the Count who was appointed by the backroom boys of the
    party. I'll bet there are many in the Liberal party who are pissed that this
    is the way the leader was picked. Just a reminder that Iggy was rejected at
    the Liberal convention that elected Dion.

    Harper knows the reputation of the Liberal party and so he is not
    underestimating them at all. He knows he has to use every arrow in his
    quiver to defeat the Liberals at their own game.

    I bet you a dollar that Martin had no intention of having Iggy replace him.
    He simply wanted a star candidate who he parachuted into a safe riding. He
    was desperate at the time. He thought he was going to be there for a long
    time. Remember when they were talking about Martin taking 200+ seats? How
    did that work out for the Liberals? We both know.

  • Opinator

    I think to bash the land of Victor Yuschenko & Yulia Tymoshenko is just… disgusting.

    Ukraine is a great nation and great partner w/ NATO (not a member yet, but close).

    Iggy just can’t lead multiethnic, multicultural Canada, period.

    Perhaps Sandra Pupatello can leave the dreary walls of Queen’s Park/King McGuinty’s Playpen and give PMSH a run for the money. Until then, I’d be more scared of the NDP than Iggy.

  • `Liz J

    It's more about what's on he 10%'ers , if the message isn't to their liking, too positive , threatens the agenda of the Opposition, they get all fussed up. We get lots of unsolicited crap via the mail, it you don't like it, recycle.

    BTW, I don't think the GG calls the PM, the request to meet would come from the PM.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    I just read through these comments – I see nothing wrong with sending out factual information in a 10%er with quotes from Ignatieff's past.

    He can't distance himself from these things – they were said in his adult life and they are relevant to the conversation as Ukranian-Canadians will want to know if he harbours any bias or resentment towards them.

    I'm sure he'd also like voters to forget that he chose to stay 30+ years outside of Canada but this too is relevant to the discussion. Would he be back here if the opportunity that arose did not come to fruition? Why would Canadians consider voting for someone who didn't miss anything about Canada except for Algonquin Park?

    I think what I object to is here is a guy who speaks and acts like he's thinks he's the smartest guy in the room, ready to spring some more Trudeau-like social engineering on Canadian society, but is trying to do so without showing his hand.

    He's reached his peak – I predict that the next election will be worse for the Liberals that the Dion result. Looks good on them.

  • terry1

    B&P….i'm glad you like facts. Too bad this government has never hit us with any. we were not going into recession last fall according to them. we were only going to have elections every four years unless the government was defeated. The libs have plenty of facts about Harpo at hand and will use them.

    I think the harpercrites will end up where Dion did last election. I see Jean pierre Blackburn in the French press today begging the Bloc not to force an election this fall. The hypocrisy is overwhelming.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Terry – feel free to use all the facts and quotes you want. However, your party's history of attacks and attack ads (soldiers with guns, tanks in our streets, the Manning / Duke comparisons) seem to show my hypothesis, that Liberals are not all that comfortable with the facts.

    Also – wern't you on here predicting a Dion win last election? Pretty quick to throw your guy under the bus!

    Here are some facts for you. Your a former economics / investment guy aren't you?

    - Canada is at 8.6% unemployment – full employment is generally agreed to be between 7-8%.

    - The Canadian market is at 10,000 – up 33% off of its low for the year and working back towards its all time high of 14,000

    - Conservatives suport the oil sands development. Canadian oil, along with the economic stimulus plan, are two of the big reasons our economy is back on track

    - Canada has the strongest economy in the G-8 (and arguably in the Industrialized world)

    Though Mr Harper's fixed election date law applies only to Majority governments, if you play your cards right it should be applicable after the next election. My prediction – blue from coast to coast.

  • terry1

    Here's the real truth about Harpo……..he lies through his teeth:
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/a-

    Maybe the Prime Minister misspoke. Maybe he was just using a figure of speech, although he could have said something like “all taxes are a necessary evil.” But even that “necessary evil” idea is different from saying all taxes are bad, because the “evil” of taxation is “necessary,” as indeed it is in any civilized society.

    Presumably, there lurks inside the Prime Minister an anger about much of contemporary society that has been built with taxpayers' money, an anger contained by the political reality that the Prime Minister can't do much about this state of affairs.

    Indeed, the comment harkens back to Mr. Harper's days shilling for the National Citizens Coalition and early years with the Reform Party, when he believed that just about everything governments were doing was bad and wasteful and led to huge deficits. Since then, and especially as Prime Minister, Mr. Harper has shelved many of those views, since a distinguishing characteristic of his government has been a reluctance to cut government spending.

    Not a single major government program has been eliminated since he took office, perhaps because of minority governments, or perhaps because political reality has shackled Mr. Harper's deep instincts that all taxes and, by extension, the programs for which taxes pay, are bad.
    ………………………

    In other words Simpson thinks Harpo is nuts

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Again – Terry – I have no issues with the facts. The PM was indeed a member of those organizations – who are protecting the interests of the taxpayer and the rights of private citizens over big government.

    The economic action plan is nothing short of brilliant – provides short term economic stimulus without structural deficit. No big government programs – just in with the stimulus projects and tax incentives and then out as the economy recovers.

    If you want to try to make a commercial or ad out of that story line please go ahead!

  • terry1

    Its funny the bank economists and the PBO all say the deficits being created are going to be structural unless tax increases follow but Harpo the great says that won't happen and we know how well he read the recession to begin with. He lies every time he opens his mouth.

    What economic action plan…bailing out union members of the CAW to support failing car companies…..some plan!!!

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Terry – are we technically even in a recession? If an economist predicts a recession and is wrong about it, is he a liar, or was he wrong? I think the latter.

    That's the issue though- don't you think that the Liberals are trying to run around pretending the economy is worse than the facts illustrate? How would the Liberal proposals of Kyoto or the Green Shift moved the economy? Come on – you are a numbers / markets guy!?

    Economic action plan = renovations tax credit for consumers – has nicely got the trades / retail markets moving; Local market stimulus – funding for roads, libraries, arenas, transit, infrastructure projects across Canada to build Canadian communities. Read up on it – it's having a big impact!

    You are arguing against the data.

  • Cat

    wow Stephen you've really hit a nerve with THIS post. I've been reading the responses and continue to follow-along as Terry tries to pull out of the muck…unsuccessfully.

    It's all fair game. The LPOC should own up to the fact that Mr. Ignatieff is your problem and with him you got the entire package or lectures, books, opinions, and can add to it all, pretty much the nothing that Iggy's done for that party.

    I feel sorry for the Liberal support base which actually believed they'd get a say in their leader, new direction and re-definition because all they've received so far is a re-gifted Dion who can speak English and we STILL don't understand what the hell he's all about.

    After the last election a total cleansing of the back room boys would have helped the LPOC too.

  • NovaDog

    Ignatieff has alot of explaining to do! I just visited the news on the republicans for ignatieff website and actually heard Iggy his own voice saying what he said, just turns my stomach. He is saying “we” americans.

    He tells the Brits he is British and he votes Labour, he tells the Americans he's a Harvard Yank and now he tries to tell me he is a Canadian.

  • lauriercluboccassionalwaitress

    Oh I seem to recall a few years back watching terry1 come out of his Crantini dampened seat to wildly applaud Paul Martin pulling on Buzz´s CAW leather jacket on the hustings. Yes that was you eh terry1….wildly applauding.

  • hollinm

    NovaDog…..remember Iggy says he is a Liberal and so in the greatest tradition of the Liberal party he will say and do anything which will get him in the PM's chair.

    If he has to be Canadian, he will be that. If he has to be American to sell his books etc he will be American. If he has to be British so he can get ratings as a talk show host he will do it. He is like a chamelon.

    Remember he pushed and supported a carbon tax. Dion did it, got trounced in the election and now it says it was the wrong policy. Remember the Libs ran against the oil sands. Now he thinks the oil sands are the greatest thing since sliced bread.

    He suggested that taxes need to go up. He is called on it and then squirms his way out of it. He talks negatively about Ukranians and when it is revealed he says he was taken out of context.

    You get my drift. Travers issued a clarion call to Iggy and the Liberals this morning with his column. He isn't biased at all by suggesting Harper makes Canadians queasy. Who in the hell is he to speak for all Canadians.

    If there is so much queasiness in the land why is there not a demand for an election? Why are the talk shows not filled with Harper haters calling for his head and why are there few if any letters to the editor demanding Harper has to go. All of this is in the minds of the Liberals, their syncophants and of course the left leaning biased media.

    By the way all polls show that Harper is best to manage the economy and on leadership he out polls Iggy signficantly.

    So Harper will continue to govern. Iggy will continue to huff and puff and talk gobbly goop all in the hope that he can fool Canadians into believing he really has a vision for the country that is different.

  • hollinm

    terry1….I was looking at the comments on the board and thought I would reply to this one.

    What lies and innuendos have the Conservatives perpetrated on the country. Because they repeat Iggy's words in a truth ad? That is not a lie. Its Iggy's own words. You may not like it but them's the facts. He said it and he cannot deny it.

    If you think that Harper has buggered the economy then tell all of us on the board what you would cut or not do. Would you be against lower taxes, more funding for the military, more transfers to the provinces for social programs and healthcare, higher equalization payments?

    Where is the slander? Only in the minds of those wearing Liberal rose coloured glasses. Harper did take a shot at Iggy based on mistaken information. However, he apologized immediately.

    People are showing they are tired of this? Where? People are ignoring all of this white noise and simply consider Harper to be the better one to manage the economy with higher leadership polling than the Count.

  • lauriercluboccassionalwaitress

    Terry a card carrying rabid Liberal. Has coughed up his $1100 to hobnob at the Laurier Club and now barks from his highness. A club, certainly with many outstanding individuals like these timeless guardians of fairness, hollow promisers of “change” and real thugs…. (link from the tyee) http://billtieleman.blogspot.com/2009/02/is-mic

  • hollinm

    bugszy….once again with the 10%'ers. If you don't like them ignore them. However, I am sure if Parliament decides to eliminate them for ALL parties or tighten the rules Conservatives would be quite happy to comply. However, they are a perfectly legitimate way to communicate with the voting public and Conservatives are going to use the tools available to them.

    You suggest that what is included in the 10%'ers is pure fabrication. You should give an example rather than making sweeping blanket statements. That is much more credible in my opinion.

  • mecheng

    Haven't had a chance to wade through all the hysterical liberal postings here, but really, my question to the Liberals would be:

    If you disagree with what the flyer said, could you please provide us with current quotes, policies, or positions from MI?

    The fact that MI refuses to take a clear position on anything, and talks out of both sides of his mouth is a BIG problem. If MI had written a book last year about his love of the Ukraine, then it would be disingenuous to pull up 7 year old quotes. But if he refuses to take a stand on any issue, it is perfectly okay for the CPC to rehash the most recent comments he made on a subject.

  • http://streetadvisorconsulting.blogspot.com markalanwhittle

    The more someone writes about themselves, and how they see the world, the faster they can be hung with it at a later date, sometimes decades later. When you pick a leader already so long in the tooth, as Ignatieff is, what would you expect, accolades from the sweaty masses? In a vacuum, fools rush in to fill it.

  • Helen

    The following comments were made by others.
    I feel that they accurately portray the state of the Liberal party in Canada
    ———————————————————————————————————

    1. First the Liberals held a Seinfeld convention….. Now with the demand for universal EI standard off the table the transformation is complete. The Liberals stand for nothing. They are Canada’s Seinfeld Party
    ———————————————————————————————————-
    2. Robert McNamara may have been a highly educated intellect, but his policies gave us the disaster that was the Vietnam War.
    The lesson: Sometimes great intellectuals just don’t make great leaders.

    That’s something Canadians might want to remember when judging the merits of a certain ex-Harvard professor now leading the federal Liberals.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    I think one of the few remaining questions to be answered is – we all know Ignatieff is going to be a disaster for the Liberal$. The question is just how much of a disaster.

    It's going to be ugly and make the Liberal$ remember why they chose Dion over Ignatieff in the first place.

  • Dela Court

    Hello Stephen;

    The last time I posted you edited and posted part of what I had to say. I don’t like that. If you are tempted to edit, please do not post my comments. I’d rather not be heard than edited.

    I think liberals should be mad at the media for not having scrutinized CI (Count Iggy’s) works extensively pre coronation. They, the media, damaged their credibility in not having done so. The public can now see for themselves that CI’s comments have been extreme in the past and that he may well have a sinister hidden agenda.

  • terry1

    Mark, I hope you say the same for the stuff Harpo has written in the past. Kinsella has some pretty good stuff ready to go that is all truthful and embarrassing. So, lets have fun come election time and we can vote for the dirtiest guys. Remember though that attack ads outside an election were started by generalissimo Harpo.

    If anyone thinlks the Libs will lie down like thye did under Dion, I have a bridge to sell them.

    Your guys haven't made it in Hamiliton yet I see.

  • terry1

    B&P, Harpo is on his third election w/o a majority and he won't even come close in his fourth. Just who is the disaster you are speaking about?

    Quebec and the Maritimes may deliver 5 to 7 seats to your gang. Tell me the rest of the story now.

  • terry1

    Helen, Harpo was considered to be an intellectual in his NCC days, such as a reformer could be, so does that make them equals?

  • terry1

    Mervin, my top five
    1 Income trust lie
    2. no recession
    3. no deficit
    4. no tax increase…. a future lie we know is going to happen
    5. accountability, no elections for four years,etc.

    I'm not against lower taxes but am against borrowing from me to justify their populist ideals by pi$$ing money down stuff they have no concept about(the auto industry for one). The Libs managed to slay the muldoon deficits and didn't hurt the economy and didn't raise taxes.
    Higher equalization payments…do you call the $1BB he gave Charest for an election tax cut equalization?

    Harpo has made many slanderous statement in the HOC he won't repeat outside… you know it very well.

    People are tired of dirty politics as played by the Harpercrites who have nothing else to sell. The poll the other day suggests that well over 65% of the population wants amjority government. Harpo can't get there and people on the left as thye have done in the past will vote strategically. The NDP loyalists are getting tired of layton and in Quebec they are showing a certain fatigue with the Bloc. Guess where that majority lies!!

    If a sitting PM can't get a higher economic rating against an opposition leader than he's brain dead to begin with. That's a stupid comparison and you know it but the Prairie has dried out certain thought processes it appears.

  • albertabob

    Very well said.

  • http://streetadvisorconsulting.blogspot.com markalanwhittle

    Yep terry1, we are surrounded by Lefties, even worse performing than Dion, here in Hamilton. Give it time though, they've delivered squat, unlike the Prime Minister. Hamilton is ripe for change.

  • Helen

    Terry1…
    Harper is much more superior…He is after all one of us.
    Same thing can’t be said of the “other” guy…THAT”s the difference.

  • hollinm

    terry1…you really are grasping at straws:

    1. Income Trust lie:

    We both know the situation changed dramatically after the election where
    major corporations i.e. telecoms and banks were considering changing their
    corporate structure to income trusts. If you honestly believe that Harper,
    knowing his election promise, woke up one morning and decided to piss off
    seniors and other investors by changing the income tax rules for income
    trusts you are beyond convincing. To cushion the blow he allowed income
    splitting for seniors and allowed for a 4 year transition to help offset the
    ramifications on the market.

    However, politicians sometimes have to make decisions they do not want to
    make but in the best interest of the country make the tough decision. I will
    match this decision with Chretien's in 1993 when he committed to axe the tax
    (GST). Chretien would have lost the 1997 election if the right had not been
    divided.

    2. No recession

    Harper cautioned the country in his year end interviews in 2007 that 08
    would be a slower year. Immediately after baggy eyes oh I mean McCallum said
    Harper was fear mongering and that growth would be 2.5% for Canada in 08. So
    much for the crystal ball.

    No one knew that the U.S. was about to have a major meltdown in its housing
    market and on wall street the likes of which never had been seen. It had
    broad implications around the world. Unfortunately Canada was drawn into the
    mess because the U.S. is our major importer. However, I will delicately
    remind you that Dion in the election campaign promised billions in new
    spending with the whopper being the carbon tax. A chicken in every pot was
    Dion's theme. So while our leaders and most of the world leaders were caught
    flat footed in respect to the degree of the slow down Harper was not by
    himself because they all said there would be no recession/deficit.

    3. No deficit

    We all know about the infamous economic update back last November which was
    never intended to be a budget. However, I would agree that Harper continued
    to be in denial of the severity of the situation. He watched as revenue went
    through the floor, unemployment was skyrocketing and the manufacturing base
    in Ontario was being demolished. So he knew something extraordinary had to
    be done. Hence he abandoned his conservative principles and decided he had
    to do something to jolt the economy.

    Of course that decision was made easier with the left wing parties,
    including the Liberals, demanding the government do something and to spend
    money to cushion the recession. Well, Harper did just that much to the
    surprise and amazement of the opposition parties and the left wing media.
    Many including you are criticizing the size of the deficit but nobody has
    had the guts to say what they would not do that Harper is doing. By the way
    the coalition of fools was forecasting a deficit of $30 billion.

    4. No tax increase….

    Tax increases are the path of least resistance and of course we know the
    Liberal record on taxes. They love to tax and spend. Hence during the 13
    years of Liberal rule our personal tax rates were the highest in the G7.
    Time will tell whether taxes need to be raised. I am glad you have a crystal
    ball and know what the government will do. The recession is not over yet and
    so there is lots that can be done before we have to go the tax increase
    route.

    5. Accountability, no election for four years.

    The fixed election date was meant for majority governments and you know it
    because it would require a change in the constitution to change the
    prerogatives of the GG. Goodale and the Libs argued vociferously during the
    debate that the fixed election date was a sham. However, nothing in the
    legislation prevented the PM from going to the GG and request dissolution.
    If it was against the law she would have denied it. It was not and you can
    argue till the cows come home but Harper had the right to advise the GG in
    order to protect the country from the coalition of fools. She could have
    refused but she knew the consequences.

    Imagine the hypocrisy of the Liberal party trying to foist onto Canadians a
    PM, Dion, who Canadians had soundly rejected just six weeks before and who
    the party was trying to throw under the bus. To work the coalition needed
    the support of the Bloc. Here they would be sitting in the House criticizing
    the coalition government and in behind the scenes negotiating what
    legislation they would support going forward. Bills which did not require
    confidence would never see the light of day if the Bloc disagreed.

    Once again what populace ideas would you be referring to. Infrastructure
    spending? Be specific or your tinfoil hat is showing again. If you do not
    support bailing out the auto industry then you agree that it is alright for
    the industry to leave Canada and instantly throw a million people out of
    work. You are blowing smoke. Even the Count is staying away from that
    stupidity.

    Again with the Mulroney deficit. You being a member of the Laurier Club know
    perfectly well that deficit spending started under Trudeau big time with
    Chretien as his finance minister. Mulroney when he left office had an
    operating surplus but the interest on the national debt which was
    skyrocketing was killing the country. He did not have the guts to slash and
    burn and the country was not willing to do live with the tough decisions.

    I give Chretien and Martin credit for covering the deficit but I would
    remind you that the deficit was covered by downloading the federal
    government's financial responsibilities on the provinces i.e. healthcare
    etc. where transfers were significantly reduced with the provinces being
    thrown into deficit. I do need to remind you that the military took
    significant hits over those years and yet Chretien/Martin had no problem
    committing them to a war they will ill equipped to fight.

    Equalization was changed and except for Nfld. the provinces were not unhappy
    with the new agreement. Quebec got what they were entitled to under the new
    agreement. The fact that Charest screwed the PM and gave tax reductions to
    the province is not Harper's fault. However, it does show the lack of
    integrity of Mr. Charest.

    Slanderous statements in the House? Oh yes the Liberal party are virginal
    sweet. They never make slanderous statements or misrepresent the facts. They
    tried desperately to create faux scandals and the public simply weren't
    buying it. Look at the Liberal party my friend they are professionals when
    it comes to slander.

    There is no dirty politics being played. The Conservatives are practicing
    the art of politics as practiced by the Liberals for many years. Liberals
    don't like it because they are disorganized internally, bereft of leadership
    (again) and have no credible policies to present to Canadians. The big issue
    above all else is they are broke and can't afford to fight fire with fire.
    So they resort to name calling.

    Your penultimate paragraph is plain silly. If you believe after Duceppe
    finishes with Iggy in the next election Quebecers are going to abandon the
    Bloc you are dreaming. NDP supporters are diehard and will stick with the
    party no matter what.

    Think about it terry1. Where will the Libs get 40+ seats to win even a
    minority? Maybe a few in Toronto and Quebec but nothing more in the West.

    The last paragraph is bizarre even by your standards. Iggy has not
    demonstrated one ounce of economic acumen. If he wants to be PM during the
    worst recession he had better move his sorry ass. Demanding a 360 hour
    qualifying period or 10 weeks for EI does not make economic sense except for
    the NDP.

    Thus is your political lesson for the day. Go in peace my friend.

  • terry1

    This guy has lost it completely:
    http://www.montrealgazette.com/life/People+want
    Prime Minister Stephen Harper has blamed the uproar over his handling of the Holy Communion host at former governor general Romeo LeBlanc's funeral mass on people trying to cause embarrassment and create division between Catholics and Protestants.

    “People who want to cause embarrassment in religion and drive a wedge between Protestants and Catholics” are driving the controversy, Harper told a Catholic news agency in an exclusive interview after his meeting Saturday with Pope Benedict.

    and this one gets even more stupid by the day:
    http://lawiscool.com/2009/03/19/min-jason-kenne
    Kenney was unable to explain how he learned so much about immigrants and visible minorities who face discrimination while growing up in Saskatchewan. He conceded his social group consisted of all white-males as a youth, but attributed that to his involvement with the Liberal Party at the time. All of the minorities were obviously hiding out in the Progressive Conservative Party of Canada.

    Or this brilliant one:

    “Min. Kenney repeated the call for immigrants to speak English or French before immigrating to Canada at a conference in Calgary, clearing up any ambiguity that may have previously existed.

    These policies are nothing more than a covert for of racism, seeking to perpetuate historic racist legislation in Canada that sought to bar ethnic minorities from entering Canada, and overturn progress made in recent years to remedy these policies.

    More recent statements seem to indicate he is backpedalling in face of sharp criticism by the public. Despite blaming the media, Min. Kenney’s statements are recorded by the media and attendees at his talks this week.”

  • terry1

    Mervin,lets get your re-education underway:

    1. You called Chretien's change on the GST a promise breaker in the past and now have changed the tune. Income splitting for seniors did not help the junior trusts who have almost all nearly bled to death. And it was not only seniors who bought those trusts.

    2. What was Canada's growth in 08….. a lot closer to 2.5% than you obviously know. Harpo and his clowns were flat out in denial that a recession was coming. He knew if he admitted that his GST cut would have looked very foolish and it does still look very very foolish in light of a $50BB deficit.

    3. No one questioned the need for spending BUT spending and tax cuts don't go together and Harpo and his populist stupidity never took the economy into account when they dropped their drawers to lend us ur own money since we are now into serious and structural deficits w/o tax increases. And Harpo the great has backed himself into a corner on that issue. He simply hopes a large dose of inflation comes along to lower his deficit with that tool.

    4. See 3 above.

    5. as usual you try to mix and match…the coalition issue and fixed election dates are different issues.

    The fixed election date was to be in place an donly broken if the government was defeated in the house and harpo found a loophole he didn't even know existed until his legal team found it…..that was dumb luck only but in spirit he broke his own law.

    The coalition was in response to extremely poor government by the reformatories. They had to run and hide for six weeks to sort out their priorities or get some which is most likely what happened.

    my penultimate paragraph wa sobviously beyond your comprehension. the NDP has gone soft in the past when the left wanted the right out of power. That's why their seat count is never ever stable. Duceppe is in trouble in quebec and continuous polls show the luibs getting stronger and stronger. The populace there is now seeing that supporting the bloc has not helped them and they know tories will screw them in a majority situation. read up on some of the recent polls there.

    As for 40 plus more seats. they will remain strong in the maritimes and will be much stronger in Quebec. I say they could come into Ontario with between 60 ad 70 seats. If they can get up to 50 in Ontario,which is highly possible, they will go over the top. BC is ready to vote liberal again as well as Manitoba at least around Winnipeg.

    come back for more lessons any time.

  • David

    I remind you that it has been the Liberals for nearly four years now that have propped up these guys.Think about that next time you need to renew your laurier club membership, deep pockets or not.

    The reality is that those who played the “hostgate” card have retreated into the wilderness. In fairness, I think that most Liberal bloggers and supporters recognized this and quit the gig early. Some however, Kinsella in particular made fools out of themselves. They have been unable to accept the word of a priest in order to try and save face.

    The spin was clearly in part designed to put a wedge in Catholics. This was a 24 hr news story. It lasted 48hrs and died.

    I have no doubt that you don't agree with the PM's comments but keeping this story alive will only serve to help the Conservatives. Lib bloggers seem to have recognized this.

  • hollinm

    Lets clear the historical facts and then call it a day:

    1. Chretien promised to get rid of the GST and when elected completely
    ignored it because he could not give up the substantial revenue it was
    generating. Of course it was a lie as was the whole Red Book thingy.

    2. Average GDP for 2008 was 0.42% so McCallum was wrong. However, I suspect
    the Liberals had no idea what was coming down the road. Similar to the PM I
    might add. Once again the coalition was forecasting a deficit of $30
    billion. Either you want spending to help the economy or you don't. You
    can't have it both ways.

    3. Harper made his decisions about tax cuts before he knew what the impact
    of the recession would be. In fact I would argue his tax cuts saved Canada
    from going into recession sooner than other countries and has reduced the
    impact on ordinary Canadians. However, that will not fit into the Liberal
    narrative will it? Economists don't like the GST cuts but the fact is people
    at the bottom end of the socio economic scale do not pay income tax and so
    the GST cut helped them.

    You have no idea whether we will have a structural deficit or not. There are
    too many variables at this point to make that statement definitely. Of
    course you can listen to Kevin Page and hang on to his every word but the
    fact is what will be will be. If there is a structural deficit the country
    can certainly afford it and when the Conservatives start cutting those
    wasteful Liberal programs we will see about the deficit. The country is
    waiting with bated breath to hear how the carpetbagger will cleanup the
    deficit.

    5. I have explained the reality of the fixed date election legislation but
    you simply choose to ignore it. Harper made that decision after the
    coalition of fools decided that we needed a new government after only six
    weeks. Faced with the same issue I believe Chretien would have jumped all
    over it.

    A coalition would have been a disaster for the country and you know it. How
    would Dion work with the Bloc and their demands which are focused on Quebec
    only. How would Dion manage a Jack Layton sitting in his cabinet. Talk about
    no control. He was a terrible leader and would have been a terrible PM
    particularly trying to run a coalition government.We would have been into
    another election within a couple of months.

    If the coalition had succeeded minority governments as we know it would
    never work in Canada. Harper is short 12 seats from a majority which by
    necessity requires all three opposition parties to defeat the government.
    That would mean in the future the three opposition parties who don't like
    the decisions of the government simply gang on vote non confidence and
    giving Iggy's reaction we could have an election every quarter in this
    country. The country would be in political chaos. Coalition government are
    sensible when the official opposition and one other party have enough votes
    to outnumber the government.

    By the way the prorogation allowed parliament to adjourn two weeks early for
    the Christmas break. They returned at their normal time in January. Don't
    get too carried away with your rhetorical flourishes.

    Obviously I don't agree with your assessment of Lib chances in Quebec. They
    will win their usual seats in Montreal and after Duceppe takes Iggy apart
    Quebecers in the regions will stick with the Bloc. You saw what Duceppe did
    to Harper and the same fate awaits Iggy.

    The polls do not show that Iggy is particularly strong in Ontario. It goes
    back and forth. However, Ontarians are not interested in higher taxes and
    big social programs so they will continue to support the Conservatives.

    I would remind you that campaigns do make a difference. Iggy has a tendency
    to make gaffes and the other leaders are more experienced. If you think the
    truths ads were bad now wait until the writ period (of course I have no
    inside knowledge). All the parties will make sure that Canadians know Iggy
    does not stand for their values and is a carpetbagger in it for himself.

  • Cat

    Funny that terry threatens Mark with what Kinsella has on Harper.
    Has it occurred to either terry(who seems to like to make it appear that he's in the know) or WK that they're losing the “defining” wars?

  • `Liz J

    Yeah, the “hostgate” card was probably killed by Dom LeBlanc who said he appreciated the fact the PM attended his father's funeral. You don't play gotcha games at a funeral and expect to get any respect from anyone. It's all about desperate Liberals hanging out in backrooms plotting their next snoop out/gotcha.

    When they have nothing substantive to offer, Kinsella is their man. He can play Barney googles in an attempt to divert attention from their “leader” who is still in professorial mode, no attempt to make any decisions on anything.

  • Beer and Popcorn

    Yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnn

  • Cat

    This has been a really good issue. I think that the problem with having a leader like Mr. Ignatieff is that he's on record and quoted in so many places and on film too. One has to wonder how far back and how much homework the LPOC war room did on Michael(Ignatieff, not Jackson) before they coaxed him back to Canada?

  • hollinm

    sorry terry1

    I did mix up the coalition with the call for an election. They are two
    separate events. However, as I explained to you the fact remains that a
    fixed election date is really only workable under a majority government.
    Calling an election under that scenario would not be acceptable. Unless we
    are prepared to change the constitution the rights of the PM to advise the
    GG and the rights of the GG remain in tact.

  • terry1

    Stephen , they are getting closer:
    Here's Raphael:

    While this is really a nothing website, and really not worthy of coverage, you may be interested to know that that the Republicans for Ignatieff website just happens to be hosted, of all of the millions of servers in the US let alone the world, by NearlyFreeSpeech.net of Cocoa Beach, Florida, which just so happens to be the same server that hosts Canadians4Democracy.ca (the anti-coalition website put up by Stephen Taylor, the Conservative blogger and “citizen journalist” who once ran for the Conservative nomination in Kingston and the Islands). Aside from many of the same formatting, use of quotations and footage, html coding style, both use the server “ns.phx6.nearlyfreespeech.net”. You can confirm that for yourself at WhoIs.

  • terry1

    Wo is losing the defining wars? Iggy has never yet countered on any dirty ads and is still very much in the lead or close to it. Imagine when his war of words starts what it will do to Hareprcrite.

    I think you got it wrong.